Articles - May 2014

Texts and travels, 1964–65

The following are the collected letters of poets George Oppen and Charles Tomlinson, as transcribed by Richard Swigg for the feature “Addressing one’s peers: The letters of Charles Tomlinson and George Oppen, 1963–1981.” This section of the correspondence spans the years 1964–65.


Brook Cottage
February 3, 1964

Dear George and Mary,

It was good to know you are having an interesting time là on tout n’est qu’ ordre et beauté, luxe, calme et volupté or whatever.

Sorry you didn’t get my note to Brooklyn.  Silly of me, all the same, to write to B’lyn. April 10th will be fine.  Will you be flying to Bristol direct or will you be entraining from London?  Let me know your plans and we’ll meet you whatever alternative you follow.

In my letter to B’lyn, I wrote, in part, to say that there’s an excellent — i.e. intelligent as to content and laudatory as to manner — account of The Materials in current number of The Review (England’s just-about leading poetry mag.)  Very enspiriting.  I’ll show you when you come rather than commit it to slow mail. The bloke (one Tom Clark) sees how the poems work and has useful things to say on the score of their syntax. There, George, did you REALISE you have SYNTAX?

I trust the muse is kind in your mild winter there.

We look forward immensely to your visit — more than once Brenda has chirped out of the evening silence:  ‘I am pleased the Oppens are coming, aren’t you?’  I am indeed.

                                               All the best


là on tout n'est qu' ordre et beauté
: Charles Baudelaire, “L’invitation au voyage.”




Brook Cottage
May 17, 1964
Whitsun Sunday

Dear George and Mary,

It was good to know that you have arrived home safe after your travels, but sad to realise how far you are from ‘just around the corner.’

The vicar returned today — Sunday — the first call since you were here!  We were  paganly luxuriating in sun on the lawn.  He brought a gift of cream.  The church owns glebe land,  but the farmer who rents it is often behind with his payments  and buys the Rev. Clegg’s good nature with far more cream than four Cleggs combined can stomach.

We attended a performance of Britten’s setting of Noyes Fludde in Cirencester Abbey the other day and joined in the hymns right lustily — the local kids played hand-bells and blew bugles and (as cats, mice, camels etc.) sang Kyrie eleison as they filed aboard  and a canonical Alleluia as they disembarked.

… Will the London book trade undertake an Oppen? …

Since you were here we  have explored the Roman villa at Chedworth and seen other things that you must NEXT year — another family church, more beautifully kept and  decorated, Mary, than Boxwell where we walked.   And we (i.e., we and you) MUST see the abbeys.

I took our Amer. friend over to look at the great tile barn at Bradford-on-Avon (5–6 miles from Bath --  another place for NEXT year) and we found the local grammar school performing As You Like It inside, the whole arranged as at the first performance with a local belle enthroned centrally and dressed as  Elizabeth I.   I think you wd. have loved this — fanfares and all from the boy trumpeters.

I took just a peek at Louis’ Bottom this p.m.  but it’s been a very rear-guard action so far.  Ars gratia artis.

I asked J. about those French translations of his verse and he replied by sending them + all his other books:  the poems are as gracious as the gift.  Why is it the anthologists so consistently ignore him?  He has a lovely ear,  an immensely clear diction and — yes — the authority of wisdom urged without any of the trappings:  family life, the war,  the uncertain peace.  If this were not a miserable age, J.L. wd. be a popular poet in the best sense.

A very old friend of ours,  Justine Schulz, will be in N. York this summer and wd. very much like to  meet you.   We shared a house with her and Juergen S. in London ten years ago and they now live in Berkeley and I think you would like them.

What a lovely stay  that was, your  being here!

                                             Love.    Ch. B. J2


The vicar returned
: Tomlinson described the earlier occasion in Some Americans: A Personal Record (University of California Press, 1981): “In England, nine months after our meeting, the Oppens were at Ozleworth on an afternoon when the vicar called. Conversation turned on the New English Bible, and I expended a good deal of wasted wrath on our pastor’s admiration for this moribund document. He explained that in order to make sure that its idiom was truly current the committee had consulted a bishop’s secretary. George was far more of a marksman than I with my incoherent rage. As the vicar was about to leave, George said with a sort of courteous finality, ‘The next time you translate the Bible, call in a carpenter — and make sure he’s a Jewish carpenter.’”

Louis’ Bottom:  Zukofsky’s Bottom: On Shakespeare (1963).

I asked J. about those French translations of his verse: James Laughlin, Certaines Choses Naturelles (Seghers, 1963), later reviewed by Tomlinson (see letter 27).

J2: The Tomlinsons’ young daughters, Justine and Juliet.




Brook Cottage
July 3, 1964

My (our) dear Mary and George,

It’s shameful  of us not to have written long before this, to thank you for (a) Heidegger’s Introd. to Metaphysics which I hope to get down to now term is (just) over  (b) the photographs taken at Bath  (how silly of us  not to have taken you both there) and  (c) the lovely pressed flowers, head-bands etcera which the children have rec’d with delight.  How lovely the little view from B’lyn Heights! Thank you so  much.

We do wish you cd. see our lane now the trees are full out — next year you must come a little later — late May or early June — it’s all so much richer, luxurianter, bigger than when it was leafless in April–May.  Yesterday  we discovered a charming, mostly Regency-Victorian seaside resort on the other side of Bristol —: Clevedon — quite a little gem, obviously unpopular bec’ mostly shingle and mud (no sand) but a beautiful iron-work pier, handsome grey-stone streets, esplanade, cliff-walk, church (where Arthur Hallam is buried — he of In Memoriam), a real cimitière marin, the marble crosses very white in the sea light, the town shapely and curtailed by a sudden upsurge of cliff which leads one into sudden open country articulated by a far-winding sea-wall.  We came  back painfully bronzed but pleased with ourselves at our discovery  (Needless to say Justine prefers BIG vulgar Weston-Super-Mare where  there is sand — and donkeys!)

Did the London publisher bite,  George ?

                               Once more, many thanks & lots of love

                                               Ch. and Br, J2

P.S.  If  our friend Justine Schultz looks you up  I think you’ll like her.

P.P.S.  That Replansky book very original.  I do hope she’ll go ahead.  Some absolutely 1st-rate things.   Justine spotted the Ratless Cat for herself!   Wrote it out too!   I told N.R.


That Replansky book
: Ring Song by Naomi Replansky (Scribner, 1952).

the Ratless Cat: one of the poems in Ring Song.




[Undated: c. July 1964]                                

Dear Charles, Brenda
        and their descendants forever:

Yes, I sent the Heidegger.  Also sent a collection of Diane Wakoski and Armand Schwerner printed by Hawk’s Well Press.  Feared that Hawk’s Well may send out almost no review copies at all, and thought the two books of some interest.  As I type this I find myself wondering whether I so value good poetry for itself, as a shield and antidote against the bad.  I thought for a moment of settling for none at all - - - - what with one thing and another - -?

A ghost of some Frankish monster - - maybe Baudelaire - - stalks Schwerner, but I think you’ll find the verse interesting at least.

No - - no bites from English publishers.  Except the Resuscitator wrote to ask for contributions. By which I am feeling very slightly resuscitated - - a mirror held before my lips in the fogs of London might show           fog.  I sent them, in order to be as un-foggy as possible, the collaboration To C.T.  Hands across the sea.  Hanover Hand across the sea.

We think of England!  Indeed England was so pleasant.  Is it good for Poetry?  Whereas here we are killing considerable numbers of people in the streets, and god know[s] we aren’t good  enough for that.  Stay me with       Cummings?  Succor me with       Oppen?

I don’t suppose I really think of the ‘state of poetry’ in terms approaching the statistical.  It’s a matter of one or two poets in any country, and England has CT        and the peopled landscape.  A difficult thing for an American poet to feel that of his own country.  I think of the people - - I think there is such a thing as humanity, and moreover that no one could exist without it.  And I think also of the land.  Of the people and the land.  And they seem to be standing on a pane of glass.  And I would so very much rather say otherwise.  I keep dreaming of a poem of final affirmation.  Can’t, probably, be done.  The ear itself knows better, and  rebels.  We can say something of - - well, what I think I’ve got hold of a little at the end of the Narrative, and we can speak of a peopled landscape - - even the Americans in their own way - - and I think that’s all we will have.  We will live by that if by anything.

                                                                           Not particularly smug, but I guess we can do it.

                                 Regards - - and many memories of Wotton under edge - -


I just tell everyone of the baby saying ‘Charming’  And of Justine’s, ‘I have a little honey when I’m poorly.’  No one believes it, but I tell them and I TELL them - -

As you said, one must retain the hierarchies,      I tell em and I tell em - -  But they don't believe us.

It is to be considered, tho, that American parents, I think, do not have and can’t have as much confidence - - even as much confidence - - in the schools as the English can have.  And so they want the children to ‘participate,[’] they want the children to see them, the parents.  The trouble there is, as Mary explained at great length to a very nice young couple we know, that the children do not see the parents living  as they, the parents, want to live.  They see them embattled and harassed by children - - - arguing over candy.  What do they learn, I wonder?  O, we tell em - -


collection of Diane Wakoski and Armand Schwerner
: Wakoski’s Coins and Coffins (Hawk’s Well Press, 1962) and Schwerner’s The Lightfall (Hawk’s Well Press, 1963).

the Resuscitator: a Bristol University poetry magazine.




as from Ozleworth
August 24, 1964

Dear George and Mary

I write this from Cambridge where we  are holidaying and whither the two booklets (for which many thanks) have been forwarded.  Schwerner is a complete discovery and I find him most individual. I had read some Wakoski before and was particularly interested to see a whole collection of the things.  They intrigue me and yet … and yet …  Is it enough to write lucid evocations of one’s psychological state?  Dead in the head, a sketchy background of incest, a divorce (?), a Mother, a schizophrenic’s feeling that other-people-are-talking-about-me. Yes, it is well done and tautly written but unless it stands in some more general relation to human fate (i.e., like Baudelaire’s Le Vampire,  say) what is to be done with it all?   I find this kind of subjectivity, offering itself at its own evaluation, with no conception of some more-than-personal standard, difficult  to evaluate.  The same thing happens in Trakl -- again, against a background of incest and tingling nerve-ends.  It fascinates me,  but I want something else in the poetry to ‘place’ its situations or its hints of situations.  She reminds me of  Anne Hébert, the Fr. Canadian, who wrote an extremely post-mortem sort of book called (I think) Le Tombeau des Rois (something  like that).  I was very impressed by it and so I am by Wakoski for all  my but, but, buts … I shd. have said more of Schwerner  but I always spend myself on my doubts.  Thanks again.

Have you read The Phenomenology of Perception by Maurice Merleau-Ponty?  The most striking book I’ve opened since yr. kind gift of the vol. by Heidegger.  It’s damned  expensive — almost  3 pounds — otherwise I’d buy you a copy.  I’m sure this is the central work of modern French philosophy-- it builds on the Husserlian basis of Heidegger and, to my thinking, is richer  because more specific about the human situation — touch, sight, space, sex, it’s all done with rigour and insight.

Brenda says, thank you,  Mary, for yours.  Juliet is mending,  but she had a wretched attack of tonsillitis 2 weeks after the operation.  She was  very run down,  but seems to be improving.  Both kids were  delighted with the  poodles and Justine has written a little letter  (more excitement than got transmitted on to  the paper!)

I  thought Bronk’s book splendid.  I forgot if I mentioned it.  It’s absolutely substantial and original, an extraordinary chastity in the performance and I have read it over several times, again and again.  It stays hard and sound and austere.  He is a very strong writer indeed.  If you see him, do give him my greetings.

Louis writes to say that Norton are to do his shorter poems in 2 vols, the 2nd conditional on whether the first leaves ’em bust.  Also Cape want to do him in England.  Why don’t you try Cape or Calder,  George?  Calder are doing Creeley and seem  to  ‘get’ the American accent.   Better there than Cape.

Love from us all — do you have a copy of that poem where the mist comes up in the fields? —

                                            love once more

                                            Charles, Brenda, J2


: Georg Trakl.

Bronk’s book: William Bronk’s The World, the Worldless (New Directions, 1964), the publication of which had been encouraged and instigated by Oppen.

that poem where the mist comes up in the fields: “The Forms of Love,” in The Materials.




August 31, 1964

Dear Charles:

Your analysis of Wakoski is very cogent, surely correct.  But I was interested in a  sort of authenticity, the very hand of that girl.  Of Zeno:  ‘I know only / that arrows do not always reach their mark’

Schwerner has sent me a long poem [“Prologue in Six Parts”] - - which quotes me at length, and is in fact a meditation around my Narrative and other work I read.  Impatient with me sometimes, but he thinks that I, like Akiba of the Haggadah came out a sane man.  Most flattering, surely.  And it is a very beautiful poem, very far beyond the work in his book - -.  I can hardly go around forcing it on peoples’ attention.  For a sane man, it’s a bit awkward.  But he seems to be a poet generating more than enough force and originality to arrive on his own feet.  I’m pleased about the Zuk - -.  I feel quite a lot of anger about the Zuk, as you must have noticed, but I continue to owe him a good deal - - - Pleased that he’ll be printed.  And still and again angry that he wishes to be printed so portentously.

Enclosed the poem.

Regards to all - - - and thanks to Justine for the very nice ‘Old Fashioned girl Holding a Lap Dog’                                                                             



‘I know only / that arrows do not always reach their mark’
: See the lines from “Elizabeth and the Golden Oranges,” Coins and Coffins (Hawk’s Well Press, 1962): “[Zeno] could not believe but wanted to know; arrows do not always reach / their target.”

Enclosed poem: “The Forms of Love.”




Brook Cottage
c. September 1964

Dear George,

I was delighted to get the Schwerner and hope I haven’t kept it too long.  It is an admirable piece, done with astonishing energy and a remarkable hold on line and rhythm.  It is so good that when it gets patchy one wonders that he could have slipped so far and so tactlessly.  I find three instances of this and, in pointing them out, hope I don’t sound ungrateful for the magnificent remainder. The dance of the Kapper meson strikes me as inadequate, even sentimental. The dance of the negative K m seems trite to the point of silliness — I  don’t think it comes off at all, nor perhaps does the humour (my third instance) in Section VI — the whole stretch at the opening, irresponsibly Millerish & immature, when he talks about knocking down nuns, sprawling with willing nurses, and so on — a tactless passage, not bawdily gay  but almost adolescent.   I’m not certain that ‘in the sweet fucking of an afternoon together’ isn’t intellectual — pop-singerish.  Also, shouldn’t he work a bit harder for his quotes? — foolish fond old man;  the still bough at the center (not a quote but a disturbing  echo of 4 Quartets);   lineaments of gratified desire (Blake).  One other and I’ve finished:  the proton, photon, graniton passage in V isn’t musically inventive enough to carry the weight he needs right there.   Doubtless I object strongly to those passages simply because (for me, at any rate) they miss the key and  compass of the rest.  Schwerner is a genuine discovery and a real poet and this piece has a most remarkable range.

Robt. Creeley reads in  London next week & the  American embassy here have asked me to introduce him.  I go down Tuesday and hope to see the big Miró exhibition at the Tate — a little cloying, I imagine, but one ought to see it.

Not much news really.  Term begins next week, alas.  Juliet now speaks sentences — rose the other morning from the toilet  and announced:   ‘I jus’ done a  charmin’  enormin’ turdy.’

                                            Sic transit gloria Monday

                                                   Love, Charles




October 9, 1964

Dear Charles:

I am far from disagreeing - - I had written to Schwerner objecting to the photon-meson sections. Tho I had failed to reach the heart - - or at least the key to the matter; that they are not ‘sufficiently inventive musically.’  And I had felt, tho I did not write of it, your objection to the ‘unearned’ quotes, as if other people’s lines were counters we could use whenever confronted - - for example - - by an elderly and unwise man.

But - - -   Some wonderfully sustained construction, as you agree.  And beyond all, the ‘A sort of outside.’  I have very great faith in a man who could write that phrase, whether or not  it ever quite got into the poem.

And there aren’t many Schwerner’s - - you won’t feel he’s very young, but Americans need a lot of time. Even Williams’ example is easily read as cavalier attitude and contemptuousness.  Detains our people these days

                                                                                                                 What impresses me about Schwerner is that it’s not ALL cavalier.

I begin to look to Juliet  for the great moments.  A charmin’ turdie is a sort of British or Cotswold beatnickism? A pleasure to know the child, anyway, without regard to race, creed or diminuitives.


I completed the Ms of This in Which - - and delivered to ND.  Should be out next year.  Removed some of the poems you saw, did some revisions - - - and quite a number of new poems.  I send you the first two pages from the book:   

(The title of the Second poem: Armies of the Plain - - To make a clean breast of the matter, one means to refer to Arnold - - - ‘Where ignorant armies clash by night.’)

(I have wished often, while working, that you and Brenda were here to discuss them, and to be read at - -)

And, the Four Poems about Poetry having become Five Poems, you might like to see this.


the photon-meson sections
: Schwerner, “prologue in six parts.”

the first two pages from the book: TS of “Technologies” and “Armies of the Plain,” in This in Which. The latter poem is a shorter version of the one eventually published.

you might like to see this: TS of number 3, “That Land,” in “Five Poems about Poetry” (This in Which).




Brook Cottage
November 12, 1964

My dear George,

I have left unacknowledged too long the three very fine poems.  They arrived when we were undergoing a second round of family flu’s, then what with the exigencies of a teacher’s life  + a week’s readings in the S.W. I seem to have got all in arrears.  I thought them splendid (pomes, not arrears or readings), hard but flexible, not a word wasted and not a cadence misjudged.  The next promises to be a splendid book altogether and I dissolve in impotent furies having written nothing for ages  on ages.  I wish there were some way of taking one’s silences on trust instead of getting depressed about them — I practically wasted a whole summer this year and have worn myself low gnawing my nails at so little achieved.  I feel somehow I’ve lost my way  among possibilities and have become quite blind as to which  way I ought to  take.  What does one say next?  Ach, I should take heart before your own enriching silence.

Justine’s latest is, after a stream of babble, ‘Mummy, what I talking ’bout?’  Reply: ‘I don’t know.  What are you?’ ‘I don't know — I must  be going bonkers.’





[Undated: c. November/December 1964]

Dear Charles

Poetry, with your review of Jay, arrives not long after your letter. The review very very fine, and sensitive - - as well as an act of justice.  I find it difficult to put my finger on the places which so perfectly define the values not only of these poems, but of all such ‘modest,’ as you use the word, poetry. ‘ …  though lightly, not irresponsible’  perhaps, and ‘ … the humiliations of relationship and the need for it’ which is a poem - - machinery aside - - in itself.  I praise you thus overtly and in detail in order to chastise my envy: I am a very clumsy man in prose, and perhaps clumsy in speaking of anyone but myself, which is no small sin. And now I have the guilt of having used you for my little New Years-like celebration on completing a ms. at a time of South West readings and flu in England.  Which was, the Mexicans would say, muy Gringo.  Or, I’m going bonkers.

It may be hard to believe, after that celebratory tootling I did by air mail, but I do rather believe in silences, or at least don’t worry about them.  I think it’s quite possible to deafen oneself with one’s own work, to blind oneself: a life’s longer than we pretend, there’s a lot of time.  I say this not to instruct you but in the knowledge that essentially we agree. Men who instinctively shave in the kitchen have an area of agreement, as Juliet recognized.

                                               with all regards


(I should have cited ‘the humiliations of relationship and the need for it’ as against ‘academic baroque.’ That does indeed say it!


Poetry, with your review of Jay
: Tomlinson’s review of James Laughlin’s Certaines Choses Naturelles, translated by Alain Bosquet, in Poetry, November 1964.

‘modest,’ as you use the word … ‘lightly, not irresponsible’: Tomlinson in the review: “James Laughlin, one of those very few poets you can describe as modest and not mean that they are pleasantly neglible …”

the humiliations of relationship: Tomlinson in the review: “his general concern — the humiliations of relationship and the need for it, whether it be domestic or social.”

academic baroque: Tomlinson in the review: “twenty years ago when academic-baroque was in …”




Brook Cottage
June 18, 1965

Dear Oppen und Muse,

That book is absolutely dazzlingly splendid, the measure of a life-time’s devotion, with never a word misplaced & never a cadence smudged.  I have read it all four or five times and it has the feel of a voyage on that sea of discovery so marvellously photographed on the cover. I have seldom enjoyed a book of verse so much — how haunting that patience and honesty can discover so spare and piercing a music. That guy Shapiro on the back cover is absolutely right: ‘the history of our poetry has yet to be written.’ Certainly This in Which puts the last twenty years into a wholly fresh perspective: if I may (for a moment) congratulate myself (vanity!) I am cheered to know I had the sense to see it a-coming when I first picked up a copy of The Materials.  George, you are gorgeous!

Pause for  verse.  A piece in the manner of Tomlinson and one in the manner of Oppen.  Which is which?  The prize is a Bahama banana or a bananed Bahama (as you choose):



In the soft 



Of the water

And the hard



Of stones



Bare  feet





On the ‘naked

Shingles drear’



By side










I could not tell whether, in the swaying light,

There were two or three feet there

Poised together at the trembling verge

Of a saffron tide on that morning

Of late October that could well have been

Early November ….


Well, who won the banana?  Actually the first piece is Oppen trying to imitate Tomlinson and the second Tomlinson trying to imitate Oppen.

Greatly looking forward to  meeting next April (ach! so far away, too!)

                  Again, many many thanks & congratulations.





June 25, 1965

Dear Charles:

It is an old man’s poetry, isn’t it?  It is moving that you are so moved by it.  As your own words seem always to stand on the edge of that, the edge of age, drawing upon the wealth of first maturity to confront the future.  To a child, and that my own, in a prospect of stone.  For example.

       And thank you for your generosity.


I could not have written the line about the naked shingles, I have such trouble remembering what it means when it doesn’t mean roofing or a disease.  It means the same as dingle, doesn’t it? only it doesn’t dangle, it slopes gently.




Little Deer Isle
Till September 1st
[Undated: c. August 1965]

Dear Charles:

Received an Agenda, with a note saying letter following; so far no letter, but it will probably be along. Unless I am having forwarding trouble once more. The Brooklyn postmaster, gent by the name of Quigley, did promise he would try --  But who knows? I’ve only glanced at the Agenda - - maybe wasn’t very fortunate in the pages I happened to turn to.  Believe there was something there about My mouth is the despair of God / formed only for man.  I really must have seen that; I hold that I am incapable of imagining it.  And turned thereafter to an interview which discussed the matter of whether or not a poet should make a New English Version of himself - -.  I turned for refreshment to your Mexican poems (which I’d read before, of course) and there under those poor damned nose-gays which a great many people had carried too far sure enough was Charles

      Squat, smiling Aztec.

                                                gave me quite a turn.  A turn most needed.

                                                       I noted again: it’s a very fine poem/    


This about the missing letter got me worrying about the mails.  I sent you a copy of This in Which - - was going to be the point of the letter - - and will send another if it’s gone astray.  I really do have an odd time with the mails.

Meanwhile we speak of you often.  And tell about the black horses and the shaving mirror, and the round churchyard at Ozleworth, which for some reason has stuck with me most clearly

And I would like to be able to say something about all those staggering ancient stones, and Brenda driving the VW competently into Bristol every day to sit with Juliet.  Of course you have something of all that in your poem of Justine ‘in a prospect of stone.’ I suppose I was wishing to be able to say it from outside only because that was of course the way I saw it. - -  as I say: we speak of you.



: the poetry magazine.

Squat, smiling Aztec: “In Michoacán,” Agenda 4, no.1 (April–May 1965); later collected in American Scenes.




October 17, 1965

Dear Charles and Brenda:

I see your name safely on the Gugg program.  Tomlinson, Bronk and Wakoski, variously introduced and housed by GO which will leave a prominent copper family considerably in my debt. The three constituting the salvation of the year’s program. And Mary and I congratulate ourselves.

We can, in fact, do slightly better for you than our attic, slightly better than our salty attic which - - - I was going to say might be hard to take, but that’s only me being rudimentarily literary;  actually we would all enjoy ourselves very much.  But we can, it happens, do still better thru my sister June’s mid-town apartment, very commodious and elegant, and June would very much like to have you and has begged me to invite you there - - - You will find it rather an 18th century footing for a poet, and elegance aside you will find 79th st just off fifth a very handy spot.  June being June Oppen Degnan, 50 East 79th St, N Y city.

- - this invitation being extended as promised to June a couple of months ago

                     we promise you a good time:  museums, zoos, ferries to Staten Island - - we await impatiently.

Let us know the dates and your preference: … always available




the Gugg program
: Introduced by Mae Swenson, Tomlinson read at the Guggenheim Museum on April 28, 1966, together with Josephine Miles, in a program sponsored by the Academy of American Poets. Under the same auspices, Oppen introduced poetry readings by William Bronk and Diane Wakoski at the Guggenheim on April 14, 1966.

Beginnings, 1963

The following are the collected letters of poets George Oppen and Charles Tomlinson, as transcribed by Richard Swigg for the feature “Addressing one’s peers: The letters of Charles Tomlinson and George Oppen, 1963–1981.” This section of the correspondence spans the year 1963.



April 15, 1963

Dear Mr Oppen,

I wanted to say how much I have enjoyed reading your volume The Materials which I’ve gone through (several times) recently.  The cleanliness, the clarity, the sureness of line and absence of ‘eloquence’ are very moving indeed.  It’s good to see such a book in print and a pleasure to return to it and recommend it to one’s friends.

I wonder if your earlier volume of 1934, noted on the jacket of The Materials, is still obtainable?  Conceivably I could buy a copy from you? I am most anxious to get hold of it and would greatly appreciate knowing if it still exists. 

                              With thanks once more and every good wish,

                                               Charles Tomlinson


: In 1963 Tomlinson was guest professor at the University of New Mexico and poet in residence at the D. H. Lawrence ranch near Taos. He was on a year’s leave from the University of Bristol, where he taught from 1956 to 1992.




364 Henry Street
April 24, 1963

Dear Mr. Tomlinson:

I have three copies of Discrete Series of which I will gladly send you one …

It’s pleasant to know that you like the Materials: it is wonderfully generous of you to take the trouble to say so.  I was troubled while working to know that I had no sense of an audience at all.  Hardly a new complaint, of course.  One imagines himself addressing his peers, I suppose — surely that might be the definition of ‘seriousness’? I would like, as you see, to convince myself that my pleasure in your response is not plain vanity but the pleasure of being heard, the pleasure of companionship, which seems more honorable.

In any case, an entirely honorable pleasure that you take the trouble to write

                                               With best regards

                                                 George Oppen                                                  




April 28, 1963

Dear George Oppen,

I was delighted and moved to receive so speedily both your letter and the book. What you say about seriousness implying one’s writing for his peers is extraordinarily good.  I’m sure there is no better concept of ‘audience.’ I think, despite what you say, Discrete Series was also writing for one’s peers and I thank you heartily for it.  One trusts that among the handful of things you’d want to rescue would be ‘The knowledge not of sorrow …’ (the first),  ‘The evening, water in a glass …,’ ‘Closed car — closed in glass —,’ ‘Party on Shipboard’ — ‘homogeneously automatic’ is a splendid phrase — ‘She lies, hip high,’ ‘Fragonard,’ ‘No interval of manner,’ ‘On the  water, solid,’ ‘Drawing.’ These are merely my favourites, not all that I liked. How admirable your taste is for unforeseen distinctions:

                                    (As soda-jerking from
                                    the private act



                                     Cracking eggs);


I like also the first part of that poem (beginning P.8).  What is remarkable is the consistency of vision (‘What I’ve seen / Is all I’ve found:  myself’ — you see, I can quote you by heart) and the growth into ever more substantial clarity in The Materials.  I was intrigued in reading and re-reading the latter to know over what period these poems had been written.  Not idle curiosity, but curiosity about the roots of excellence which cannot, surely, be wholly bad.  I wonder also how conscious a group activity objectivism was? — I see such differences between, say, you and Williams and Reznikoff, I cannot help wondering whether Zukofsky’s objectivist programme was not later than objectivist verse which is so disparate.

These half questions move on the surface of a deep enjoyment that your lovely poems have given me over the past weeks and I apologize for allowing them to intrude into what began as an expression of thanks and pure delight.

Perhaps we may chat of these matters in the not too near future?  My wife and I pass thro’ New York on our way back to England in mid-August and if the money lasts conceivably we shall stay for a few days.

I bring out a new book of verse of my own this summer & will send it to you — not for comment, just for friendship.

                          Again, thank you and every good wish for your work.

                                              Charles Tomlinson


a new book of verse
: Tomlinson refers to his collection A Peopled Landscape (Oxford University Press, 1963).




May 5, 1963

Dear  Charles Tomlinson:

‘Happy that company who are intoxicated with each other’s speech; who, through the fermentation of thought, are each other’s wine.’

Sa’ib of Isfahan, the translation by Edward Browne.  Or; ‘our language is our country’   I’m not sure of the accuracy of that quotation.

I hadn’t thought the Discrete Series ‘bad,’ but I do think the poems require the help, the very great good will of the reader.  Which you generously supply. I had meant to carry the thinking and the form of these poems as far as I could without abandoning the figures of perception for the figures of elocution, or even of mere assertion, which I profoundly distrusted.  There seemed at the time a tremendous difficulty of honesty: the whole weight of sincerity seemed to rest on one’s own shoulders.  As how should it not? But there was perhaps not a body of honest contemporary work, a sincere and public conversation in which to join.  Not, perhaps I should add, that I take truthfulness to be a social virtue. I think very probably it is not. But I think it is poetic: I think really that nothing else is. The sentimentality of an old codger? - - but I was a mere fine broth of a codger at the time.  

It’s been pleasant to be invited to talk about oneself - - and to speak with such affection!  I see I have rather sneakily accepted praise.  But I am reminded, quite against my will, that the poems are, after all, fragmentary and sometimes strained.

As to the ‘Objectivists’ - - the  word properly in quotes because the word has caused some confusion: it derived from an insistence on ‘objectification,’ on form, a matter worth mentioning in the wake of the Amy Lowells.  Tho’ Zukofsky wrote also of ‘sincerity’ as the ‘epic quality.’

As  you suggest,  no one’s work altered, so far as I know, after the word was coined.  It appeared in - - I think three  - - essays that Zukofsky wrote.  And of course those are simply Zukofsky’s essays.  I must have owed more to Zuk.  than either Williams or Rezi could have:  both Rezi and Wms being older than Zuk and I younger.  I had seen Zuk’s work in Exiles in, I think, 1928 - - being nineteen or twenty at the time - - and had set out to meet him. His conversation and criticism was important to me, was of great  importance to me at the time.  I don’t remember therefore that the essays themselves  came as anything new to me.

I noticed that Williams, in the autobiography, speaks of the first meeting of the Objectivists in an apartment on Columbia Heights.  That would have been our apartment, my wife’s and mine.  But what we discussed then was the undertaking to print books.  The work of course already existed in ms. and the dust jackets of the books carried the explanation, written at that meeting by Reznikoff,  that the ‘objectivist press was an organization of writers who had joined together in order  to print their own work  and that of others which they  thought ought to be read.’ It was about as  much as could be said.  We were  of different backgrounds; led and have led different lives.  As you say, we don’t much sound alike.  But the common factor is well defined in Zuk’s essay. And surely I envy still Williams’ language, Williams’ radiance; Rezi’s lucidness;  and frequently Zukofsky’s line-sense.

Those essays, by the way, are reprinted in Kulchur No 7.  I had not seen them  for some twenty years.  I can’t judge their current interest, having known them so long. And the style is crabbed.  But they seem to me sound statements.

An essay of mine, slightly referring to these things, will appear in Kulchur 10, incidently.

Not sure if you wanted all this, but I’ll complete the history.  The Objectivist Press derived from To Publishers;  paper-bound books printed by my wife and me in Toulon.   Printed the Objectivist Anthology - - edited by Zukofsky - - and Williams’ Novelette and Other Prose.

Commercially disastrous.  Paper-backs were new to the U S, and encountered trouble with the  U S customs and the U S customs - - the men on the pier, and the men in the book stores.  Both of whom said they are not books.  The book stores simply would not stock them, or most would not.  Thereafter that meeting on Columbia Heights, etc.

The poems of The Materials were written between 1958 and 1962.  As I believe you surmised.  Too long,  too personal  a story to undertake here:   I kept nothing of the little I wrote for some twenty five years.  That matter of one’s peers - - I have come to believe again, perhaps in  more rather than less despair, that the only possible hope is in the conversation with one’s peers.  Or in thinking as if one were in contact with one’s peers.

In England,  a couple of years ago,  I visited Tim Pember, a writer whose work I had seen - - stories - - and he showed me your work among others.  I was struck and delighted.  Reason for my promptness in reply to your first letter.  I have lost Pember’s address, and I don’t know whether he indicated that you knew each other.

I’m sorry, since you will be in New York, that we will be in Maine in August. Unless toward the end of August - - ? You are welcome in Little Deer Island, in our rented cabin,  if you could possibly make it.

                                                 With regards

                                                 George Oppen


“our language is our country”
: Oppen is partly remembering the line from Tomlinson’s “Return to Hinton,” which he would have seen in Poetry, June 1961 (later collected in A Peopled Landscape, 1963).

Zuk’s essay: “Sincerity and Objectification,” in Poetry, February 1931.

Kulchur 7 (Autumn 1962): Louis Zukofsky’s “Five Statements for Poetry.”

Tim Pember: Timothy Pember, author of the novels The Needle’s Eye (Jonathan Cape, 1948) and Swanson (Cape, 1951).




May 31, 1963

Dear Charles Tomlinson:

I find myself entranced by the poem with which you have presented me.  I see myself - - slightly the elder of the two - - talking to myself - - and smoking my pipe, which is a shock.  I congratulate the three of us on the whole thing.  Perhaps I would want to use it as the epigraph of a book.  Just as you have written it; that is, with your uncapitalized lines in contrast to my habit of capitalizing initial letters to emphasize the different ear at work and the effect - - I don’t know if I am expressing this accurately, but I wanted to say, as if it were heard, rather than written - -

We will enquire about an apartment for you.  I believe something will turn up.  We could offer you the use of our place, but it is impossibly small for a family of four; it would be impossible to put two children in it, unless they should happen to be v-shaped, like corner shelves. I’m afraid you may not have gone to those extremes of planned parenthood.  Of course, because you did not plan to stay in New York.

Your response to my ‘Persian quotation’ is a very nice event.  It was not Persian. I had meant to quote you, but couldn’t remember where I had seen the poem.  It seems I mis-quoted.  Of course it was ‘… our language is our land.’ But I am glad your statement - - even mis-quoted - - seemed good to you, as - - even mis-remembered - -  it did to me.


                                                 George Oppen


the poem with which you have presented me
: Tomlinson had sent Oppen a short-line poem composed from two sentences in Oppen’s letter of April 24 (“I would like, as you see, to convince myself … which seems more honorable”). It was published in Oppen’s next book, This in Which (New Directions, 1965), as a collaboration under the title “To C. T.”




[Undated: c. June 1963]

Dear Charles Tomlinson:

Sorry to say we did not find a sub-let for you.  Young artist by the name of Peter Young thought he might find something, and will write you if he does.  There seems to be a summer rush to New York.  Lord knows why.  Seemed no more attractive than usual when we left. 






c/o Lawrence Ranch
San Cristobal
New Mexico
July 9, 1963

Dear George,                                                                                        

Just a line to say thanks for your efforts in seeking us an apartment.  Suddenly, out of the blue, a friend in Brooklyn wrote to say he’d be away for summer, wd. we like his …? So we leave for there about the 29th, staying till we sail on Aug 17th. It’s splendid up here — mountains, streams, Spanish graveyards, bears, coyotes.  Pity to leave, really, but I wd.  like to see a little art in the urbs.

Just reviewing yr book, so I’ve re-read the WORKS and very enjoyable it has been — review the New Mexico Quarterly to appear the Lord Knows when.   Will send you my own new book, due Aug 29th, as soon as I get back to England.

What a shame we shall not be able to meet.  If you get over là bas,  our address is:

                                                  Brook Cottage

                                                   Wotton-U-Edge           [U for Under]



Are you writing?  You owe us (the universal we speaking) more pomes for own good.

                                               All the very best



reviewing yr. book
: Tomlinson’s review of Charles Reznikoff’s By the Waters of Manhattan, Selected Verse (Charles Boni, 1930) and Oppen’s The Materials (New Directions, 1962), in New Mexico Quarterly 34, no. 1 (1964).




[Undated: c. July 1963]

Dear Charles:

We’ll be in New York August 1st to the 15th - - a change of plans - -.  Let us know how to reach you.

Yes, I’m writing quite a bit. A fair sampling will appear in July Poetry.  And elsewhere, but as you say of the Quarterlies, the Lord knows when.

                                                       Best regards





July 27, 1963

Dear Charles:

I enjoyed very much reading your review.  Thanks for sending the copy.  I will have a copy made for New Directions-SF Review for the mention of Zuk.  They have three or four volumes of prose in the works of which I have just no opinion at all - - in fact my report on the first two mss shown me was that nothing in the world would induce me to read them through.  But the first years’ poetry schedule consists of Oppen, Reznikoff and William Bronk, in which my advice is obvious enough.  My recommendation of course included Zuk, but the suggestion - - as you see - - has not been acted on.  It is by now too awkward for me to discuss the matter with Zuk at all, but it is my impression that they would be more likely to do a Selected than a Collected poems, if only for budgetary reasons.  I can’t really urge Louis to submit a ms. since I have no assurance at all that they would accept it.  But you might urge him to try it if you think it worth the risk - -  to him - - of a rejection.  If they had a ms. under consideration I could re-open the discussion.

                                          Look forward to seeing you.





[Undated: c. September 1963]

Dear Charles:

I want to thank you for a people[d] landscape - - I read the quote from Millet as a statement of realism, of imagism, for a moment, and then its sense began to dawn on - - the meaning of factualness, which I think is the deepest meaning of the poems.  I had seen it first in the soldi, soldi, against the sea - -.

We did very much  enjoy seeing you (the American plural: youse).  It would be well worth the voyage to walk and talk with you (youse) in England. We will try to do it.

                                       With all best wishes, all regards,


your quote from John Cage in Poetry is a considerable contribution to the discussion. I thought rather less of it as a poem than you, but it is the statement of an attitude - - Mary and I have been referring to it incoherently as a ‘fun’ attitude - - which we have been unable to grasp.  And which is very much the attitude of most of the young people, the young people  around the galleries - -

Can’t live on that, tho.  No one can.  I don’t mean to deplore or to attack: can’t live on the convictions of the past either.  But they cannot live on that. Something will happen.  Something.  Not impossible that what will happen is that they will cease to live, of course - -.  I am not suggesting that we should lie to each other, this is simply where we are.  I agree we must say so, I made my own defense in the last poem of my book - - ‘We must talk now’ or we abandon one another.  Still, as fun, as hilarity - -  There is something I know, in my bones, about that.


the quote from Millet
: the epigraph to A Peopled Landscape: “I want the cries of my geese to echo in space. Jean-François Millet.”

soldi, soldi: In “Up at La Serra,” in A Peopled Landscape.

your quote from John Cage in Poetry: In his review, among others, of Harold Rosenberg’s Tradition of the New (Poetry, August 1963) Tomlinson quoted and praised Cage’s poem “On Nothing.”




Brook Cottage
September [ ], 1963

Dear George and  Mary,

What a pleasure it was to get your note — I had imagined you would still be basking at Nassau and here you are, back already beating with the great pulse.  Did we really only meet twice? — it seemed qualitatively so much more than that and what was so good about our meetings was the possibility of conversation — dialogue.  I began to think that almost nobody in the U.S. ‘went in for’ dialogue: so many literate males — oh, the women are much nicer — simply talk at one: men of my own generation, men younger than me, older men — one becomes their audience and little more.  I’d become quite anxious about this self-absorption:  one grew to expect it. Ultimately, exasperated, I penned my reply — with as little punctuation as possible, in order that I might get


 Tell me about yourself they

 say and you begin to

 tell them about yourself and

 that is just the way I

 am is their reply: they play

 it all back to you in another

 key, their key, and then in mid-

 narrative they pay you a

 compliment as if to say what a good

 listener you are I am

 a good listener my stay

 here has developed my faculty I will

 say that for me I will not

 say that every literate male in

 America is a soliloquist, a

 ventriloquist, a strategic

 egotist, an inveterate

 campaigner-explainer over and

 back again on the terrain of him-

 self — what I will

 say is they are not un-

 interesting: they are simply

 unreciprocal and yes it was a

 pleasure if not an unmitigated

 pleasure and yes I did enjoy our

 conversation goodnightthankyou


This is by way of saying YOU weren’t like that. The above is not the sole impression we took home.  It was a great year.  Perhaps the best we have ever had … Back here, rain has been virtually incessant.  Our pipes had burst last winter ruining dining room, ceilings and books.  So wetly in wet we wait, mould on every hand, feeling our premature aches and pains.  Why, it almost drives one to monologue.

I wonder if you have the address of the San Francisco Review, George?  I have an article on a Berkeley painter and I thought I might try them.

As I go up the field for mushrooms I think of your promise to come one day and walk on English ground with an Angle.  You will need rubber boots.  Come to think of it — there are spares.

                          Do let us know how things are with you both.

                                        Love from Brenda and myself,



A Word in Edgeways
: written June–July 1963, and collected in The Way of a World (Oxford University Press, 1969).




September [ ],  1963

Dear Charles and Brenda:

Words well wielded edgewise.                                                            
                                                           In fact I got to laughing too much to be able to  read it aloud, and Mary had to read it.  So it had a salutary effect: I mean, Mary got a word in edgewise.  Not only improved, but comforted me; I was glad to be assured there are many worse than I.  Which really I had suspected.  Why O why do they do it?  Partly the presence of the man from Outside, an opportunity to write their names in the sky, or anyway on something at a considerable distance.  Possibly England.

We do think and talk very seriously of a visit to the Underedge of Wotton.  Or Wotton-Underedge. Doesn’t mean we’ll manage to do it.  We become very conscious of age,  of the limitation of time, of what we want to work out still.   But if we should find ourselves feeling or being rich, we might invest in plane tickets for the spectacular extravagance of a one week visit in Spring.  What would you think?  What would be a good  time?  Would flying Americans be too much for your nerves? This only asked as wild speculation — I don’t know that we  could do it.   But we would  like to.  The Severn adds its lure.

On the S F Review — now an annual.   They have had a rule against critical articles  of all kinds, but an essay on a Frisco painter - - Berkeley painter - - really should constitute reason for an exception.  I’ll talk to June Degnan about it - - I  think the policy  excluding discussion of art has always been a mistake in any case - -. And I think you should write her offering to send the article if they are interested.   Address

                               June O. Degnan
                               Hampshire House

                                150 Central Park South

                                New York City


I should not have bothered you about that poem.  I regretted it at the time.  But this was the contrivance:

[Oppen inserts a sketch of an elevator door with two globes above it, one crayoned red, one green, with the words “Meaning UP and DOWN,” in a reference to the Discrete Series poem “White. From the.”]

So familiar at the time that I don’t think anyone was puzzled at the time.  Printed c 1930 in Poetry.  The office building evoked by its lighting effects in those dim days.  And its limited alternatives, the limited alternatives of a culture.  And its quiet / stone floor.  From there to ‘thus’ - - big business - - ‘hides the parts.’

                                                                                                 Don’t for the love of Pete let this worry you further.  Your version of the child and the ball - - - up, down, up down -  - -  is a gift, and a good one.  I accept.  And the other is lost - - it so happens - - in the mists of architectural history.  And cannot be restored to the consciousness of any reader without a red crayon.  And a two-color print job, which is prohibitively expensive.

                                   - - Similar thing, Louis’ saw horses.  Which I think was entirely clear at the time.  The A’s, the M’s, the horses, the words, do dance and only thru the verse - - all of which he meant as a programmatic statement for his verse.  The primacy of music.

I had heard of Louis delivering half hour diatribes about That Oppen to innocent visitors, one of whom, at least, made a silent and edgewise exit.  Not, I hope, to you?  But perhaps I had better say that Louis really has no grievance against me, nor has the world, or no greater grievance than it has against anyone in these times of the population explosion.  And Louis no greater grievance against me than against anyone who ‘gets printed.’  Awkward for me, tho.  And overwhelmingly ironic to discuss my position as ‘a success.’  I hesitated to go into it, fearing I might become an inveterate explainer on the terrain of myself, but hearing that I am less inveterate than some - - -  Perhaps the effect of your poem has been more comforting than salutary after all. (and I’ll doubt that I’ll produce another book within quite a few years. Maybe that’ll heal things)

                  ‘This earth, this throne of Kings, this England - -’  You mean the man was looking down at his rubber boots when he said that?

                                                                                               But Mary’s from Oregon, a good deal wetter than anything you can show, and New York is the worst climate in the world.  AND has  no mushrooms.

                                            with regards to you both



June O. Degnan
: Oppen’s sister.

Your version of the child and the ball: In his review of The Materials (New Mexico Quarterly), Tomlinson had mistaken the elevator signs in “White. From the” as the up-down motion of a child bouncing a ball.

Louis’ saw horses: Police saw-horses in Zukofsky’s ‘A’-7.




Brook Cottage

 Ozleworth Bottom



  September 21, 1963


Dear George and Mary,

Thanks for yours.  I am now dully (how does one spell due-ly?) elevated by your two colour design.  Lucidity itself.

Why don’t you come and stay during next Easter vacation?  It’d be lovely to have you both.  Not Easter week, when the rest of the world is abroad, but one of the other four of our recess.  The weather should be springy then and the summer rains will not have begun in full fury.  I must check when Easter is next year.  DO come.  We are painting the guests’ bedroom and will do it with added zest at the prospect of your advent.  You wd, I think, love the parish churches round here and the general intimacy of the green landscape with its walls of grey stone.

Thank you so much for Mrs Degnan’s address.  I’ll send off the MS. with this.

                                               Tante belle cose,


        P.S. How about this?

In Longfellow’s Library


 and the Venus de Milo

 gaze out past

 the scintillations from

 the central candelabrum

 to where

  (on an upper shelf)

 plaster Goethe

 in a laurel

 crown, looks

 down, divided

 from a group

 dancing a tarantella, by

 the turquoise butterfly

 that Agassiz

 brought back

 dead: below

 these, the busts of

 Homer, Aeschylus

 and Sophocles still

 pedestalled where

 they ambushed Hiawatha.


In Longfellow’s Library
: written July 1963 and published in American Scenes (Oxford University Press, 1966).




October 1, 1963

Dear Charles and Brenda:

You better mean it: we accept.

A few details to clear up, but almost anyone - - even a vicar - - can can tell us when  Easter is, surely.  The guest room painted with Zest takes care of it from A to Z

when love has commen with lent to town, we will be in Gaynest under Gore.  And walk in those green fields.

                                              With all our affection,


     (Yes: our cultural resources.  Longfellow and all.  I imagine the butterfly on a pin?  but a flimsy affair compared to the word that pins the poem:
that Agassiz

 brought back

 dead: below




Brook Cottage
October 18, 1963

Dear George and Mary,

Of course we didn’t mean it — Easter don’t exist:  it’s just one of those Xtian myths disproved by the 19th Century.  April fool!

But, serieusement:  my vacation is March 10th to April 20th, Justine will be out of school March 25th – April 13th.   Why not come in April, as late as possible if only to make sure of good weather and also to MISS the mass holiday, i.e., Good Friday to Easter Monday, that is March 27th–30th.

I write more briefly than I would like, since term is upon us … We’ve just finished painting ‘the Oppens’ room’ as we call it.   Can you stand a babbling brook  outside in the garden or shall I have the authorities switch it off?

Love and great anticipation.   If Winter comes can George and Mary be far behind.





Brook Cottage
November 19, 1963

Dear George and Mary,

I’d meant to write long before this to say, yes, April 6–13 wd. be fine for the visit — the visit.

At the moment rain and floods everywhere.  I trust they will have dried out by April.  Not usually the cruellest month here.

In haste and the desperation of dozens of essays to grade (‘mark’ we say — I  spikka da Amurricana fur clarity’s sake).






Brook Cottage
December 29, 1963

Dear George and Mary,

How very kind of you to send us the Mailer and the very fine poem.  We had always intended reading Barbary Shore and now we own a copy we shall do so.  We enjoyed Naked and the Dead immensely but found, despite the good bits, The Deer Park was a sad, tired falling off.  He’s an interesting chap, hipsterism apart, or maybe hipsterism is a necessary part of getting off the ground these days?

We seem to have had a dreary phase of ‘sore trials’ since our return — first Justine was hospitalised, then detonsilled, then a dock strike immobilised our imported car on a London wharf for three months; then my father fell ill, was operated on, recovered, relapsed with congestion of the lungs and is now slowly coming forward again.  Workmen came in to dig us a septic tank, struck three springs, got flooded out. Tedious additions like that.  In the middle of the digging  + removal of inner wall of the house, frost struck unexpectedly and  froze the water supply for three days.  Oh, but this is pure grumbling.  Really, I begin to ache with self pity: ‘Tell me about yourself they / say …’   Basta.

We do hope you had a nice Christmas.  Ours, sandwiched between chaoses, was pleasantly intime and cloistral.  Our one visitor, the vicar, brought a bottle of home-made wine; we walked in the afternoon of Xmas day with the children — a  lovely, suddenly mild, sunlit time with Ozleworth valley swelling and green despite the recent pressure of frosts, the stone walls very solid yet visionary in the lowering light and the trees looking their brushy, knuckled winter selves.

We look forward to Aprille with hir shoures swote.  All the best for 64.

                                              Charles and Brenda